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Rismagi Player-Rank: 3 Rismagi is a male
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Weapon Research Tree with mutually exclusive techs:



Edit: Fixed Bio-bombs

This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by Rismagi: 16.06.2009 11:31.

29.11.2008 18:37 Rismagi is offline Send an Email to Rismagi Search for Posts by Rismagi Add Rismagi to your Buddy List
Erwin [CS] Player-Rank: 2 Erwin [CS] is a male
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Interesting! Does it come with new Weapon, Shield, Drive tables (properties, resource requirements, etc)?
29.11.2008 19:04 Erwin [CS] is offline Search for Posts by Erwin [CS] Add Erwin [CS] to your Buddy List
Rismagi Player-Rank: 3 Rismagi is a male
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Components 2.0

I just changed some names and added resource requirements.
29.11.2008 20:51 Rismagi is offline Send an Email to Rismagi Search for Posts by Rismagi Add Rismagi to your Buddy List
Erwin [CS] Player-Rank: 2 Erwin [CS] is a male
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Looks great! Thanks! Smile

I think UN has got a "balance validity check" for ship-components progression too. Would be great if you could cross check if the progression is right according to your algorithms. Anyone else is of course welcome to have a closer look at the progression (and other aspects) also.
29.11.2008 21:02 Erwin [CS] is offline Search for Posts by Erwin [CS] Add Erwin [CS] to your Buddy List
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at first glance i kind of like it. everything seems like a nice progression, with mutually exclusive techs things get a bit more effective. quick glance at the 4th tier, cold fusion only has two techs while advanced magnetism has three. both have an engine tech but the engine tech for cold fusion is more efficient for space used but the engine for advanced magnetism only takes one space which adds flexibility. In summation i am liking the balance initially.

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Rismagi Player-Rank: 3 Rismagi is a male
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I am not sure about including Biological warfare into Weapons branch. It can't be compared with any other modules. So I added one more component to this tech. Alternative solution would be to leave BW optional, like it is now.

Doctrines is self-explanatory, but in this case there should be a description for all components in the tree, icons of resources required and probably some attributes. New player should not make a decisions based only on component name and type.
30.11.2008 09:50 Rismagi is offline Send an Email to Rismagi Search for Posts by Rismagi Add Rismagi to your Buddy List
DarkLStrike Player-Rank: 3
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Well, good job! It lowers the number of research topics and I thinks that's what we all want Wink .

Maybe change the name railgun back to mass driver for old times sake? Smile

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railgun and mass driver basically mean the same thing and mass driver sounds way more sci-fi in my opinion so i vote for mass driver.

Erwin, if you are wanting my input on the outputs of the various items then you will have to wait a few days(thursday at least). work and all. Crying

Like i said before, I really, really like it and i say start programming it because the only changes i would argue for would be value changes, the overall form is very good. maybe eliminate the dependancy chain from nuclear fission to fusion power since you have to run through the intervening techs anyways, seems like a redundant connection anyways. And we need to have a naming contest in the general forums. I don't think i would have done any better but those names need some work. Wink But that could be after implementation anyways.

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Rismagi Player-Rank: 3 Rismagi is a male
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quote:
Originally posted by uncountednose
maybe eliminate the dependancy chain from nuclear fission to fusion power since you have to run through the intervening techs anyways


The idea is to give an option to skip "Nuclear Power" and "Photon Mechanics" and go to "Fusion Power" right from the start (and research "Photon Mechanics" later), because any weapon can not be put on the line with new drive at colonization age.
30.11.2008 19:41 Rismagi is offline Send an Email to Rismagi Search for Posts by Rismagi Add Rismagi to your Buddy List
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give people the option to skip early techs? they won't come back to them.

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quote:
Originally posted by uncountednose
give people the option to skip early techs? they won't come back to them.


I don't think so, because:

1. Fusion Pulse Drive can not be put into colony shuttle, so you will need to research a corvette;
2. There are many ways player can choose, where he will find himself without bombs or heavy weapons or light weapons;
3. Early techs has its own advantages: low upkeep cost and only common resources to build.
01.12.2008 08:59 Rismagi is offline Send an Email to Rismagi Search for Posts by Rismagi Add Rismagi to your Buddy List
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- added one more drive to be an alternative to Antimatter Drive.

Descriptions for most Drives:

quote:

Nuclear Thermal Drive
In a nuclear thermal rocket a working fluid is heated to a high temperature in a nuclear reactor, and then expands through a rocket nozzle to create thrust.
Size: small
Cost: v.low
Upkeep: low

Nuclear Fission Drive
Engine uses constant nuclear reaction for thrust. The performance of the design is much better than Nuclear Thermal Drive.
Size: small
Cost: v.low
Upkeep: low

Fusion Pulse Drive
Engine uses hydrogen bombs to generate pulses as the easiest way to utilize fusion power. Such design can have high performance for its level.
Size: medium
Cost: low
Upkeep: low

Ion Drive
An ion thruster is a form of electric propulsion that creates thrust by accelerating ions. The thrust created is small compared to Internal Fusion Drive, but its advantages are propellant efficiency and size.
Size: v.small
Cost: medium
Upkeep: v.low

Internal Fusion Drive
Engine utilize the low energy nuclear reactions - nuclear fusion occurring at near-ordinary temperatures and pressures. Main advantage of internal fusion drive - very high specific impulse, the main disadvantage - size of the reactor.
Size: big
Cost: low
Upkeep: low

Antimatter Catalyzed Drive
A variation of fusion pulse propulsion based upon the injection of antimatter into a mass of nuclear fuel. Smaller and cheaper to build than a fusion pulse engine of similar power, gives better performance.
Size: medium
Cost: medium
Upkeep: medium

Antimatter Powered Drive
Engine uses controlled amat annihilation to heat a working fluid; Direct conversion of part of the propellant to thermal energy. Reasonably reliable and cheap, very good performance.
Size: small
Cost: low
Upkeep: high

Monopole Catalyzed Drive
A microgram of permanent monopoles is enough to allow an engines to make more. Monopole catalyzed drives serve as the ancestors of the first conversion drives.
Size: v.big
Cost: medium
Upkeep: medium

Darkmatter
Size: medium
Cost: high
Upkeep: v.high

Conversion
Engine uses magnetic monopoles to convert any matter directly to energy, usually in a catalyzed fusion plasma. While expensive, heavy, and complicated, such equipment is much cheaper than any Darkmatter powered drive, as well as being much, much safer.
Size: v.big
Cost: medium
Upkeep: high

Singularity
A combination of advanced techniques as well as the ability to manipulate space, enable the largest breakthrough to date: the Singularity Drive.
Size: medium
Cost: v.high
Upkeep: v.high


Its purpose is to help players to choose between different techs.
Feel free to move it to suggestions forum.

This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by Rismagi: 07.12.2008 14:01.

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railgun sounds much more cool and warfare ish

but yeah mass driver sounds more sci - fi

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I kinda like the freedom we got in chooseing what to research now.

even with this idea, newbies wont know what to research untill they test it out.. so i'd just say : keep the tech chooseing freedom! Big Grin

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quote:
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Just a quick reminder: SpaceCiv is a GAME...

This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Destructor: 07.12.2008 15:40.

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quote:
Originally posted by DarkLStrike
Well, good job! It lowers the number of research topics and I thinks that's what we all want Wink .


In my opinion, I would rather have the cost of research be the limiting factor and not have one tech cancel out another. Maybe if there were so many research options that a player could simply not research everything, it would have the same effect. I love options, give me options.

Edit: How about an Ion cannon that disables a ship for a given time instead of just destroying it...?

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This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by Arcady: 07.12.2008 23:03.

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quote:
Originally posted by Arcady
Edit: How about an Ion cannon that disables a ship for a given time instead of just destroying it...?


No, think about the implications before suggesting ideas...

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Or better yet...

Take my poor excuse for an idea, discuss the implications, realize the pro's and con's, and come up with a working idea...


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I admit that I often post just what comes to my head at the time, but I don't think that's too much of a problem myself. If no one thinks something I post is worthwhile, there will be no discussions and it will be buried and maybe deleted.

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07.12.2008 23:29 Arcady is offline Send an Email to Arcady Search for Posts by Arcady Add Arcady to your Buddy List
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Sorry that I was a bit rude earlier. Your idea is nice, but it doesn't really fit in spaceciv. I mean, disabling whole ships with single weapons doesn't really work in a turn based strategy game where battles happen in an instant. In real time strategy games, we can mess with effect times and cool down times to attempt to balance it, but in turn based games, we don't have such luxury.

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I'm not intending to hijack this thread, and I don't plan on continuing to discuss this particular topic (at least in this thread). I do have to disagree and say that I think it is possible. Perhaps there could be ship components that did not just injure a ship via hitpoints, but also affect other stats as well. Yeah, that would mean tracking yet another variable (or more) attached to each ship, but I don't think that's impossible. There could possibly be speed modifiers, or firepower modifiers, or scanning range modifiers... I don't see why it would be hard to add things such as cool down times either, but to me, that would be the most difficult part. I don't really know how much support there is for tracking variables across turns, or what the implications of that would be, but I think it's possible. The trouble really is that there is so much going on with changes to this game, that these kinds of things seem like minor enhancements with a lot of hard work.

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right now the options with weapons is research them now or research them later. with branches cancelling each other out the choice changes to research this or research that. you will end up with about the same number of engines/shields/weapons that you do now so you are not actually losing anything you just have to make a choice, do you want the big powerful less versatile engine or the smaller less powerful more versatile engine. It seems to me this cahnge is increasing options, not decreasing. You should be able to finish the majority of the tree in the majority of your galaxies so limiting by just increasing costs is a very bad idea as far as i am concerned.

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